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PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 12:30 pm 
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He's #9 on this list.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/draft- ... mpaign=nfl

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:08 am 
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As it stands, this defensive tackle class leaves a lot to be desired. There are a handful of guys in the Day 2 mix, with only “tweeners” like Jonathan Allen and Solomon Thomas getting first-round hype. One guy who we believe should be firmly in that Day 2 mix is the ultra-productive Tulane defensive tackle, Tanzel Smart. Smart was an iron man, playing 100 snaps in a game against Louisiana-Lafayette this season. Even though he rarely came off the field, Smart was still PFF’s ninth-highest-graded interior defender last season.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:29 am 
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WaveProf wrote:
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As it stands, this defensive tackle class leaves a lot to be desired. There are a handful of guys in the Day 2 mix, with only “tweeners” like Jonathan Allen and Solomon Thomas getting first-round hype. One guy who we believe should be firmly in that Day 2 mix is the ultra-productive Tulane defensive tackle, Tanzel Smart. Smart was an iron man, playing 100 snaps in a game against Louisiana-Lafayette this season. Even though he rarely came off the field, Smart was still PFF’s ninth-highest-graded interior defender last season.


Does "even though" make sense to anyone at the beginning of they last sentence?

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 12:55 pm 
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Gerry---- I dont think its good writing, but it does "make sense" to me. Players that are on the field as often as he was typically have a lower PFF. Or at least that is what the sentence implies.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:22 pm 
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Prof, thinks PFF is an advanced stat he pretends to know about but it's actually the abbreviation of the website posting the story... :lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:24 pm 
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WaveProf wrote:
Gerry---- I dont think its good writing, but it does "make sense" to me. Players that are on the field as often as he was typically have a lower PFF. Or at least that is what the sentence implies.

I agree that's what it implies, but it still doesn't make sense to me. PFF is just the website. So basically, even though he played all the time, he was a top ranked player. Doesn't make sense unless their ranks are based on productivity per play.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:25 pm 
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gerryb323 wrote:
WaveProf wrote:
Gerry---- I dont think its good writing, but it does "make sense" to me. Players that are on the field as often as he was typically have a lower PFF. Or at least that is what the sentence implies.

I agree that's what it implies, but it still doesn't make sense to me. PFF is just the website. So basically, even though he played all the time, he was a top ranked player. Doesn't make sense unless their ranks are based on productivity per play.

Oh, the PPP. Yeah, Prof knows about that one, too. :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 2:23 pm 
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Pete--I'm not claiming to know the stat. At all. I'm claiming the sentence implies that it is a stat. I'm interpreting the sentence, nothing more. And I thought the sentence was fairly clear (if badly written). If they have the wrong initials for the stat, not my business. I don't care about the NFL let alone the draft (except that I'd like to see Tanzel drafted for his sake) so I don't much care about (nor follow) 40 times and obscure saber-metrics that get talked about ad nausea come draft time.


Gerry--If there is no such stat, or if he is calling it the wrong name, then it would seem that the unclear part of the sentence is the "PFF" not the "even though"

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 2:31 pm 
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WaveProf wrote:
Pete--I'm not claiming to know the stat. At all. I'm claiming the sentence implies that it is a stat. I'm interpreting the sentence, nothing more. And I thought the sentence was fairly clear (if badly written). If they have the wrong initials for the stat, not my business. I don't care about the NFL let alone the draft (except that I'd like to see Tanzel drafted for his sake) so I don't much care about (nor follow) 40 times and obscure saber-metrics that get talked about ad nausea come draft time.


Gerry--If there is no such stat, or if he is calling it the wrong name, then it would seem that the unclear part of the sentence is the "PFF" not the "even though"


PFF = Pro Football Focus, aka the website. Their ranking of players.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:31 am 
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gerryb323 wrote:
WaveProf wrote:
Gerry---- I dont think its good writing, but it does "make sense" to me. Players that are on the field as often as he was typically have a lower PFF. Or at least that is what the sentence implies.

I agree that's what it implies, but it still doesn't make sense to me. PFF is just the website. So basically, even though he played all the time, he was a top ranked player. Doesn't make sense unless their ranks are based on productivity per play.

Most defensive linemen rotate out occasionally. It's hard to maintain a high level of play when you're in the defensive trenches every snap. It's poorly written, but they're basically complementing his endurance/conditioning, saying he was able to maintain a high level of play despite being on the field way more than most other defensive linemen.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 1:27 pm 
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gerryb323 wrote:
WaveProf wrote:
Gerry---- I dont think its good writing, but it does "make sense" to me. Players that are on the field as often as he was typically have a lower PFF. Or at least that is what the sentence implies.

I agree that's what it implies, but it still doesn't make sense to me. PFF is just the website. So basically, even though he played all the time, he was a top ranked player. Doesn't make sense unless their ranks are based on productivity per play.

They grade players like a coach would, evaluating every play. Hence, PFF’s ninth-highest-graded interior defender. So, he played all the time and still graded out very well, even though you'd expect his grade to suffer on the extra 20-40 or so plays when he was theoretically tired.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:10 pm 
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ml wave wrote:
They grade players like a coach would, evaluating every play. Hence, PFF’s ninth-highest-graded interior defender. So, he played all the time and still graded out very well, even though you'd expect his grade to suffer on the extra 20-40 or so plays when he was theoretically tired.


So, basically, what I said before Pete had a tizzy :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:46 pm 
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WaveProf wrote:
...I'm claiming the sentence implies that it is a stat....
How do you get that?
Basically, the sentence says, "Smart was still [our] ninth-highest-graded interior defender last season." I see no way to read that as a "stat."


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:05 pm 
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Honestly Roller, by the time you get to advanced saber metric "stats", I don't see much difference between a stat and a "rating". Both seem equally obscure and arbitrary. I'm pretty sure you'll disagree with that because you believe in math. I don't. At least not for ranking things like players.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:27 pm 
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WaveProf wrote:
ml wave wrote:
They grade players like a coach would, evaluating every play. Hence, PFF’s ninth-highest-graded interior defender. So, he played all the time and still graded out very well, even though you'd expect his grade to suffer on the extra 20-40 or so plays when he was theoretically tired.


So, basically, what I said before Pete had a tizzy :mrgreen:

No. You're an idiot

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:29 pm 
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ml wave wrote:
gerryb323 wrote:
WaveProf wrote:
Gerry---- I dont think its good writing, but it does "make sense" to me. Players that are on the field as often as he was typically have a lower PFF. Or at least that is what the sentence implies.

I agree that's what it implies, but it still doesn't make sense to me. PFF is just the website. So basically, even though he played all the time, he was a top ranked player. Doesn't make sense unless their ranks are based on productivity per play.

They grade players like a coach would, evaluating every play. Hence, PFF’s ninth-highest-graded interior defender. So, he played all the time and still graded out very well, even though you'd expect his grade to suffer on the extra 20-40 or so plays when he was theoretically tired.

The idea that he would be down graded because he might be a little tired from playing all the time is ridiculous. The fact that he can play so many plays at a high level should work to his credit in a grading system based on viewing performance vs stats.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:17 am 
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gerryb323 wrote:
ml wave wrote:
gerryb323 wrote:
WaveProf wrote:
Gerry---- I dont think its good writing, but it does "make sense" to me. Players that are on the field as often as he was typically have a lower PFF. Or at least that is what the sentence implies.

I agree that's what it implies, but it still doesn't make sense to me. PFF is just the website. So basically, even though he played all the time, he was a top ranked player. Doesn't make sense unless their ranks are based on productivity per play.

They grade players like a coach would, evaluating every play. Hence, PFF’s ninth-highest-graded interior defender. So, he played all the time and still graded out very well, even though you'd expect his grade to suffer on the extra 20-40 or so plays when he was theoretically tired.

The idea that he would be down graded because he might be a little tired from playing all the time is ridiculous. The fact that he can play so many plays at a high level should work to his credit in a grading system based on viewing performance vs stats.

You are missing the point (or I am not making it clearly). He is playing significantly more than other players against whom he is being compared. You would then expect him to be relatively tired (or less fresh) on a fair number of those plays. You would also expect him to have a lower grade on plays when he is tired. Not graded lower because he is tired, but maybe doesn't have the explosion to get upfield, or the strength to fight off a double team, or the legs to run down a back on the outside, etc. PFF's point is exactly yours...he grades out well, and factoring in that he was presumably tired on a lot of those plays makes his good grade look even better.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:26 am 
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ml wave wrote:
gerryb323 wrote:
ml wave wrote:
gerryb323 wrote:
WaveProf wrote:
Gerry---- I dont think its good writing, but it does "make sense" to me. Players that are on the field as often as he was typically have a lower PFF. Or at least that is what the sentence implies.

I agree that's what it implies, but it still doesn't make sense to me. PFF is just the website. So basically, even though he played all the time, he was a top ranked player. Doesn't make sense unless their ranks are based on productivity per play.

They grade players like a coach would, evaluating every play. Hence, PFF’s ninth-highest-graded interior defender. So, he played all the time and still graded out very well, even though you'd expect his grade to suffer on the extra 20-40 or so plays when he was theoretically tired.

The idea that he would be down graded because he might be a little tired from playing all the time is ridiculous. The fact that he can play so many plays at a high level should work to his credit in a grading system based on viewing performance vs stats.

You are missing the point (or I am not making it clearly). He is playing significantly more than other players against whom he is being compared. You would then expect him to be relatively tired (or less fresh) on a fair number of those plays. You would also expect him to have a lower grade on plays when he is tired. Not graded lower because he is tired, but maybe doesn't have the explosion to get upfield, or the strength to fight off a double team, or the legs to run down a back on the outside, etc. PFF's point is exactly yours...he grades out well, and factoring in that he was presumably tired on a lot of those plays makes his good grade look even better.


That does explain it better! Well done. And we can all agree their expertise must be football and not writing :)

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 1:05 pm 
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Very local story on Tanzel by Loyola student and WBB player.

https://twitter.com/carolinegonzo34/status/857618717668233217


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