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 Post subject: State of YOGWF discourse
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:06 pm 
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Very recently we have had some here question the viability of or call for the outright firing of: our second year baseball coach; our second year men’s basketball coach; our longtime women’s basketball coach; the women’s golf coach; others? The only ones unscathed are football and perhaps bowling, although gutter balls could change that.

Lord knows as longtime Tulane fans we are starved for success. Those of us around longer than some of you have been fogging a mirror understand.

We are here because we all want to see Tulane do well. But just like the national discourse, we have turned at times ugly here on YOGWF, which does none of us any good. This is one of the few places I come as an escape from politics but even here some folks can’t help themselves from using those same political dog whistles...”snowflake” comes to mind. I’m one of the least snowflake-y folks you’ll find but it sets my teeth on edge.

Try try try to be civil in your healthy differences of opinion here. Write only what you absolutely would say to someone standing in front of you. Let Troy Dannen do his work.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:17 pm 
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This is a blow off steam forum, so things will get testy & exaggerated. The anonymity helps that along.

I don't pay attention to the people who only post angry crap when things go bad and who can't be found after a win. I DO pay attention when a poster capable of happiness and optimism gets dark.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:15 pm 
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TUPF wrote:

Try try try to be civil in your healthy differences of opinion here. Write only what you absolutely would say to someone standing in front of you. Let Troy Dannen do his work.


When people regrettably turn to name calling and personal attacks, that's all they have left in the tank.

Howevever, disagreeing about giving a coach 4 years (2016-2020) in order to fully evaluate his turnaround project without question is completely nuts. We should be able to have that disagreement without being silenced.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:23 pm 
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long green wrote:
This is a blow off steam forum, so things will get testy & exaggerated. The anonymity helps that along.

I don't pay attention to the people who only post angry crap when things go bad and who can't be found after a win. I DO pay attention when a poster capable of happiness and optimism gets dark.
No, it's not, and never has been, a "blow off steam" forum. The site rules offer some specific guidelines which should enable people to determine what is proper on this forum and what is not.

But TUPF is correct.
Come here to share news or come here to find out what's going on. Opinions are good discussion generators, but do not come here simply with an intent to cast aspersions, because that does nobody any good, and it only aggravates many. We have a lot of posters who used to be very helpful in bringing news and analysis to the rest of us, but who have now ceased to participate, citing the animosity as the reason.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:33 pm 
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DrHullabaloo wrote:
TUPF wrote:

Try try try to be civil in your healthy differences of opinion here. Write only what you absolutely would say to someone standing in front of you. Let Troy Dannen do his work.


When people regrettably turn to name calling and personal attacks, that's all they have left in the tank.

Howevever, disagreeing about giving a coach 4 years (2016-2020) in order to fully evaluate his turnaround project without question is completely nuts. We should be able to have that disagreement without being silenced.


Ok, thanks. I Thought it was just me. I thought maybe I was going nuts.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:40 pm 
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DrHullabaloo wrote:
...We should be able to have that disagreement without being silenced.
It's a matter of propriety, as the rules explain (anybody who thinks they can improve on JtS' wording is welcome to give it a try, but it might be like trying to better Thomas Jefferson's Declaration).

This is a public site, where the entire world can listen in if they care to.

While one might ruthlessly berate their relatives in private, most people chose to be much less argumentative in public, preferring to reserve the airing of dirty linen for the privacy of home. That's an analog.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:42 pm 
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visualmagic wrote:
DrHullabaloo wrote:
TUPF wrote:

Try try try to be civil in your healthy differences of opinion here. Write only what you absolutely would say to someone standing in front of you. Let Troy Dannen do his work.


When people regrettably turn to name calling and personal attacks, that's all they have left in the tank.

Howevever, disagreeing about giving a coach 4 years (2016-2020) in order to fully evaluate his turnaround project without question is completely nuts. We should be able to have that disagreement without being silenced.


Ok, thanks. I Thought it was just me. I thought maybe I was going nuts.


Except it is violation of rule 2 and probably a violation of subsections C and E

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:24 pm 
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Roller wrote:
long green wrote:
This is a blow off steam forum, so things will get testy & exaggerated. The anonymity helps that along.

I don't pay attention to the people who only post angry crap when things go bad and who can't be found after a win. I DO pay attention when a poster capable of happiness and optimism gets dark.
No, it's not, and never has been, a "blow off steam" forum. The site rules offer some specific guidelines which should enable people to determine what is proper on this forum and what is not.

But TUPF is correct.
Come here to share news or come here to find out what's going on. Opinions are good discussion generators, but do not come here simply with an intent to cast aspersions, because that does nobody any good, and it only aggravates many. We have a lot of posters who used to be very helpful in bringing news and analysis to the rest of us, but who have now ceased to participate, citing the animosity as the reason.


All such forums are blow off steam forums, however you may harrumph. Pete R. has said this I don't know how many times: anyone who thinks the discourse here crosses any line of online decorum should spend a little time checking out other teams' forums.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:29 pm 
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Maybe there’s a reason why some of us only post here?

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:44 pm 
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long green wrote:
This is a blow off steam forum, so things will get testy & exaggerated. The anonymity helps that along.

Maybe everyone should do what I did and not be anonymous. :mrgreen:

That was a purposeful choice I made 13 years ago because it reminds me to think about what I say. This past homecoming I was confronted, though in a somewhat lighthearted/teasing way, by an employee of Tulane who was a contemporary of mine in Tulane athletics, with a "well, if it isn't 'Mr. Internet opinion poster guy' " (or something to that effect). I hadn't seen this person in about 27 years and that was how I was greeted. It made me think about things I'd said, and how they might have formed opinions of me by people in the RD administration (they probably wouldn't be too keen on me) and the TD administration (I've been almost entirely positive). This person had worked under both, so I was curious how that conversation was about to go after that greeting. Thankfully, said person pretty much agreed with me.

Then I think about some things various folks here have said over the years, and I have to wonder who those people are and how they'd behave in front of me in person. I offered to meet folks when I was at homecoming, and met a few. Without fail, everyone I've met from this board has been delightful when talking face to face. We're all enthusiastic Wave fans, ya know? But there are some here who post stuff that just makes me wonder.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:56 pm 
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long green wrote:
All such forums are blow off steam forums, however you may harrumph. Pete R. has said this I don't know how many times: anyone who thinks the discourse here crosses any line of online decorum should spend a little time checking out other teams' forums.
You're welcome to inhabit those forums as much as you want to. We try to maintain a higher standard that those other sites.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:04 pm 
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PeteRasche wrote:
long green wrote:
This is a blow off steam forum, so things will get testy & exaggerated. The anonymity helps that along.

Maybe everyone should do what I did and not be anonymous. :mrgreen:

That was a purposeful choice I made 13 years ago because it reminds me to think about what I say. This past homecoming I was confronted, though in a somewhat lighthearted/teasing way, by an employee of Tulane who was a contemporary of mine in Tulane athletics, with a "well, if it isn't 'Mr. Internet opinion poster guy' " (or something to that effect). I hadn't seen this person in about 27 years and that was how I was greeted. It made me think about things I'd said, and how they might have formed opinions of me by people in the RD administration (they probably wouldn't be too keen on me) and the TD administration (I've been almost entirely positive). This person had worked under both, so I was curious how that conversation was about to go after that greeting. Thankfully, said person pretty much agreed with me.

Then I think about some things various folks here have said over the years, and I have to wonder who those people are and how they'd behave in front of me in person. I offered to meet folks when I was at homecoming, and met a few. Without fail, everyone I've met from this board has been delightful when talking face to face. We're all enthusiastic Wave fans, ya know? But there are some here who post stuff that just makes me wonder.
Well said, Pete. FWIW, I find myself in total agreement with about 90% of what you post, and I don't hold any animosity for any issues of disagreement. There are others with whom I disagree 90% of the time, but I hold no animosity there, either--I just consider the source. ;-)

"Back in the day," it was customary to use an online moniker, so although I have absolutely no designs on "anonymity," I assumed the customary procedure. Anybody who feels a need to know more about me need only ask. My opinions are my own, and I don't expect everyone (or even anyone, for that matter) to agree. And I always reserve the right to change my opinions when confronted with more information, so don't anybody bother to come around with those silly "last year you said..." comments.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:10 pm 
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long green wrote:
This is a blow off steam forum, so things will get testy & exaggerated. The anonymity helps that along.

Agree

As for basketball, the season's over and the conversation hasn't been the least bit untoward.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:12 pm 
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The biggest conversation piece on this board usually deals with uniforms and colors of helmets and hats. And there is nothing wrong with those fluff pieces but that unfortunately happens when your athletic teams are losing. When the conversation turns serious than sometimes it may get ugly and that is ok. Healthy debate should be encouraged. You should be able to stand up for your position. For years the pattern has been the same. We hire a new coach, he is the greatest thing ever for two to three years, then the people who were his staunchest supporters and blasting the naysayers turn on him quicker than Usain Bolt. And then the next cycle starts.

But the debates on this board are usually very well thought out and create a TULANE outlet for all of us, a school we love, and that will never end for the people that post on this board regularly.

Pete, like you, I decided to disclose who I was after debating it over and over, but I thought it was the right thing to do. I wanted to give some insight, both good and bad, into our baseball program. The facts are the facts. Though a lot of it has been met with disagreement, the conversation is usually healthy and give us something more serious to discuss.

As far as opinions go, I believe every one should be allowed to express what they want - it is just an opinion. Just don’t cross the line and go after the student athletes. These kids chose Tulane and sacrifice so much to make all of us proud and though they may not win as much as we like, these are the young men and women we support.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:24 pm 
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Good Post !!


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:05 pm 
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No doubt things could be improved. It would be great if people didn't pop into a thread just to criticize someone while having nothing to offer on the topic itself. It would also make it better if people didn't feel the need to take sides with someone despite that person's rudeness. Last but not least it would be much better if someone didn't feel the need to misstate what another poster says just to try claim the the higher moral ground when they have clearly lost the argument.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 4:25 am 
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Amen to all of the posts here encouraging civility in posting. I hate it when people get into nasty arguments here. Supposedly we are all pulling for the Wave to succeed.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:18 am 
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I'm happy to reveal my identity to anyone who wants to know, it's just that I'm a nobody :lol:

In all seriousness, the few YOGWFers I've met in person have always been green to the core and that's the most important thing in my book. I would like to think that's representative of the other folks on here and for the most part the evidence backs that up. We won't always get along, but there are really too few of us right now to get too upset over internet chatter.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:31 am 
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TUPF wrote:
Very recently we have had some here question the viability of or call for the outright firing of: our second year baseball coach; our second year men’s basketball coach; our longtime women’s basketball coach; the women’s golf coach; others? The only ones unscathed are football and perhaps bowling, although gutter balls could change that.

Lord knows as longtime Tulane fans we are starved for success . Those of us around longer than some of you have been fogging a mirror understand.

We are here because we all want to see Tulane do well. But just like the national discourse, we have turned at times ugly here on YOGWF, which does none of us any good. This is one of the few places I come as an escape from politics but even here some folks can’t help themselves from using those same political dog whistles...”snowflake” comes to mind. I’m one of the least snowflake-y folks you’ll find but it sets my teeth on edge.

Try try try to be civil in your healthy differences of opinion here. Write only what you absolutely would say to someone standing in front of you . Let Troy Dannen do his work
.


Please TRY TRY TRY to understand that I am among many out here who are just absolutely sick and tired of LOSING! Football compiled another losing season as well as both basketball teams. If baseball does not make a winning comeback this season, then Tulane will be a loser in all four main sports. Progress is being made is some areas, but the losing continues. When does that end?

I am willing to give Fritz and Dunleavy another year to produce a winner. I do see progress, but I am only willing to give them each ONLY ONE year. If either coach can not get it done, then someone else needs to step in. I will make a future judgment on baseball at the end of that season
.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:08 am 
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IM42lane wrote:
TUPF wrote:
Very recently we have had some here question the viability of or call for the outright firing of: our second year baseball coach; our second year men’s basketball coach; our longtime women’s basketball coach; the women’s golf coach; others? The only ones unscathed are football and perhaps bowling, although gutter balls could change that.

Lord knows as longtime Tulane fans we are starved for success . Those of us around longer than some of you have been fogging a mirror understand.

We are here because we all want to see Tulane do well. But just like the national discourse, we have turned at times ugly here on YOGWF, which does none of us any good. This is one of the few places I come as an escape from politics but even here some folks can’t help themselves from using those same political dog whistles...”snowflake” comes to mind. I’m one of the least snowflake-y folks you’ll find but it sets my teeth on edge.

Try try try to be civil in your healthy differences of opinion here. Write only what you absolutely would say to someone standing in front of you . Let Troy Dannen do his work
.


Please TRY TRY TRY to understand that I am among many out here who are just absolutely sick and tired of LOSING! Football compiled another losing season as well as both basketball teams. If baseball does not make a winning comeback this season, then Tulane will be a loser in all four main sports. Progress is being made is some areas, but the losing continues. When does that end?

I am willing to give Fritz and Dunleavy another year to produce a winner. I do see progress, but I am only willing to give them each ONLY ONE year. If either coach can not get it done, then someone else needs to step in. I will make a future judgment on baseball at the end of that season
.
I stepped on campus in August of 1974 during the afterglow from the previous year’s 14-0 upset of LSU in front of a massive crowd across from my 4th floor perch in Phelps dorm. When I went to the Pike frat house their prized possession for all to see was a part of the goalposts. My suitemate chose Tulane because of the LSU win. When the football team went 5-0 in fall of 1974 we were giddy. Then QB Foley broke his ankle and it all went to hell. Losing record for all of my four years. I get it.

Losing is no fun for anyone. I don’t know how to answer the when does that end question except to say I have enjoyed the brief glimpses of winning enough to stay around for 44 years. Plus, I’m a slow learner. If it’s no longer fun for you, why beat yourself up? A ONE YEAR ultimatum you have set for yourself is an arbitrary tripwire for Tulane happiness. After all, it’s just a bunch of kids playing games.

My father-in-law died in August at age 90 after following the Phillies and the Eagles for 84 years. He used to sneak into ballparks that are long since gone. He said both the Phillies and Eagles drove him crazy but he never gave up. The Phillies have lost over 10,000 games—more than any other professional sports franchise in American history. He LOVED the couple of Phillies World Series wins in his lifetime and especially the one in 2008. I only wish he had made it a few more months to see the Eagles’ SB win. He’s my model for loyalty. You stick with a team despite its foibles, missteps, and stupidities, and when the successes come you relish them like they will never happen again.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:15 am 
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very succinctly put TUPF. From time to time I see posters putting out ultimatums and can only conclude, as you did, "If it’s no longer fun for you, why beat yourself up?"

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:33 am 
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This site is far more civil than many on the internet but, stated bluntly, that's a ludicrously low bar.

I post anonymously but several people here know who I am (if you're all that curious, pm me and I'll tell you--I promise it is boring, however). I do think a reminder can be useful of the forum rules, especially concerning civility to each other, avoiding even veiled political references, and not calling for coaches to be fired in-season. We, as a group, seem to be slipping on all of these things, and I know it leads to me checking in and posting less often (which, admittedly, may not be entirely a bad thing).


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 12:19 pm 
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I'm actually Rick Dickson. I joined this site to monitor the plebes and stir up disgust, err, discourse on my tenure as AD.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 12:47 pm 
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gerryb323 wrote:
I'm actually Rick Dickson. I joined this site to monitor the plebes and stir up disgust, err, discourse on my tenure as AD.

You have a pretty thick skin, Rick! :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:33 pm 
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gerryb323 wrote:
I'm actually Rick Dickson. I joined this site to monitor the plebes and stir up disgust, err, discourse on my tenure as AD.


I was seriously convinced maddog was Dickson for a while

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