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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:45 pm 
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https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/g- ... li=BBnba9I

$125,000 to elite prospects who don't want to bother with 1-and-done and would rather, you know.... make $125,000 for a year.

Hmmm, let's see.... go to college, take classes, take tests, put forth enough effort to pass the first semester so you're eligible for the second semester....

....or get paid $125,000 to just play basketball.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 7:48 pm 
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Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:17 pm 
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windywave wrote:
Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

"Non-qualifiers"

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:20 pm 
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gerryb323 wrote:
windywave wrote:
Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

"Non-qualifiers"


Pink?

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:29 pm 
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windywave wrote:
gerryb323 wrote:
windywave wrote:
Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

"Non-qualifiers"


Pink?

Yes

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:46 pm 
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windywave wrote:
Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

So you really think the top, I dunno, 10 or 20 high school players in the country each year (they haven't said how many of these contracts will be offered), all guys who have nothing but hoop plans and have only been doing a year of college for the past decade or whatever because they had to, will choose college over $125,000? Really? That's more than probably 98%+ of people in the world will ever make in a year and they're being offered it as an 18 year old, along with basically a promise that they'll be a high draft pick. Most of these kids would jump at half of that. And if they wouldn't, their mommas would make the decision for them. Or their AAU coaches (in exchange for a small piece, obviously... 'cuz AAU...).

I don't know where you got those impressions of how much these kids are pampered in college (most schools don't fly private, or stay at swanky hotels, and the steak dinners are few and far between, you're eating the equivalent of Bruff most times). And you still have to drag yourself to class, do some semblance of studying, have no spending cash, and follow the rules enough to not get caught and become ineligible to play that very year (like the kid from Arizona last year who should have been ruled out for the duration).

And also realize this immediately opens them up to being paid advances by agents, making shoe deals, etc. That's where this is really going to be the score. They might make "only" $125,000 from the league but they'll be signing 7-, maybe even 8-figure deals with Nike or Adidas or whoever. No worries about NCAA crap.

No way the elite kids choose college.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:02 pm 
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PeteRasche wrote:
windywave wrote:
Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

So you really think the top, I dunno, 10 or 20 high school players in the country each year (they haven't said how many of these contracts will be offered), all guys who have nothing but hoop plans and have only been doing a year of college for the past decade or whatever because they had to, will choose college over $125,000? Really? That's more than probably 98%+ of people in the world will ever make in a year and they're being offered it as an 18 year old, along with basically a promise that they'll be a high draft pick. Most of these kids would jump at half of that. And if they wouldn't, their mommas would make the decision for them. Or their AAU coaches (in exchange for a small piece, obviously... 'cuz AAU...).

I don't know where you got those impressions of how much these kids are pampered in college (most schools don't fly private, or stay at swanky hotels, and the steak dinners are few and far between, you're eating the equivalent of Bruff most times). And you still have to drag yourself to class, do some semblance of studying, have no spending cash, and follow the rules enough to not get caught and become ineligible to play that very year (like the kid from Arizona last year who should have been ruled out for the duration).

And also realize this immediately opens them up to being paid advances by agents, making shoe deals, etc. That's where this is really going to be the score. They might make "only" $125,000 from the league but they'll be signing 7-, maybe even 8-figure deals with Nike or Adidas or whoever. No worries about NCAA crap.

No way the elite kids choose college.


Where are you more likely to drop in the draft college or league? A buck and a quarter isn't much compared to the difference in first round or second

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:08 pm 
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I'll concede that if you can sign a 100MM shoe contract not contingent on where you're draftes G league makes sense.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 8:37 am 
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PeteRasche wrote:
windywave wrote:
Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

So you really think the top, I dunno, 10 or 20 high school players in the country each year (they haven't said how many of these contracts will be offered), all guys who have nothing but hoop plans and have only been doing a year of college for the past decade or whatever because they had to, will choose college over $125,000? Really? That's more than probably 98%+ of people in the world will ever make in a year and they're being offered it as an 18 year old, along with basically a promise that they'll be a high draft pick. Most of these kids would jump at half of that. And if they wouldn't, their mommas would make the decision for them. Or their AAU coaches (in exchange for a small piece, obviously... 'cuz AAU...).

I don't know where you got those impressions of how much these kids are pampered in college (most schools don't fly private, or stay at swanky hotels, and the steak dinners are few and far between, you're eating the equivalent of Bruff most times). And you still have to drag yourself to class, do some semblance of studying, have no spending cash, and follow the rules enough to not get caught and become ineligible to play that very year (like the kid from Arizona last year who should have been ruled out for the duration).

And also realize this immediately opens them up to being paid advances by agents, making shoe deals, etc. That's where this is really going to be the score. They might make "only" $125,000 from the league but they'll be signing 7-, maybe even 8-figure deals with Nike or Adidas or whoever. No worries about NCAA crap.

No way the elite kids choose college.

Of course, that supposes that you're not already making $125k plus in college...

It will be interesting to see how much the shoe companies are willing to pay for someone who will be totally anonymous for a year in the G league. Maybe there will be tiered contracts that pay a few hundred thousand for a year and then step up depending if/how high they're drafted?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 8:49 am 
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ml wave wrote:
PeteRasche wrote:
windywave wrote:
Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

So you really think the top, I dunno, 10 or 20 high school players in the country each year (they haven't said how many of these contracts will be offered), all guys who have nothing but hoop plans and have only been doing a year of college for the past decade or whatever because they had to, will choose college over $125,000? Really? That's more than probably 98%+ of people in the world will ever make in a year and they're being offered it as an 18 year old, along with basically a promise that they'll be a high draft pick. Most of these kids would jump at half of that. And if they wouldn't, their mommas would make the decision for them. Or their AAU coaches (in exchange for a small piece, obviously... 'cuz AAU...).

I don't know where you got those impressions of how much these kids are pampered in college (most schools don't fly private, or stay at swanky hotels, and the steak dinners are few and far between, you're eating the equivalent of Bruff most times). And you still have to drag yourself to class, do some semblance of studying, have no spending cash, and follow the rules enough to not get caught and become ineligible to play that very year (like the kid from Arizona last year who should have been ruled out for the duration).

And also realize this immediately opens them up to being paid advances by agents, making shoe deals, etc. That's where this is really going to be the score. They might make "only" $125,000 from the league but they'll be signing 7-, maybe even 8-figure deals with Nike or Adidas or whoever. No worries about NCAA crap.

No way the elite kids choose college.

Of course, that supposes that you're not already making $125k plus in college...

I think some of us were supposing they are

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:01 am 
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gerryb323 wrote:
ml wave wrote:
PeteRasche wrote:
windywave wrote:
Be big man on campus fly private stay at the peninsula and eat steak while playing against college kids or take a bus while playing against bitter 25 year olds makinf 35 K who will beat the doody out of you and try and embarrass you while you make a buck and a quarter?

So you really think the top, I dunno, 10 or 20 high school players in the country each year (they haven't said how many of these contracts will be offered), all guys who have nothing but hoop plans and have only been doing a year of college for the past decade or whatever because they had to, will choose college over $125,000? Really? That's more than probably 98%+ of people in the world will ever make in a year and they're being offered it as an 18 year old, along with basically a promise that they'll be a high draft pick. Most of these kids would jump at half of that. And if they wouldn't, their mommas would make the decision for them. Or their AAU coaches (in exchange for a small piece, obviously... 'cuz AAU...).

I don't know where you got those impressions of how much these kids are pampered in college (most schools don't fly private, or stay at swanky hotels, and the steak dinners are few and far between, you're eating the equivalent of Bruff most times). And you still have to drag yourself to class, do some semblance of studying, have no spending cash, and follow the rules enough to not get caught and become ineligible to play that very year (like the kid from Arizona last year who should have been ruled out for the duration).

And also realize this immediately opens them up to being paid advances by agents, making shoe deals, etc. That's where this is really going to be the score. They might make "only" $125,000 from the league but they'll be signing 7-, maybe even 8-figure deals with Nike or Adidas or whoever. No worries about NCAA crap.

No way the elite kids choose college.

Of course, that supposes that you're not already making $125k plus in college...

I think some of us were supposing they are

I know I am


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 10:04 am 
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I suspect part of the assumption of this deal is that the G-League won't be quite as anonymous anymore. Depends on how many of these contracts they're offering. If they are offering like 54 (2 per team), that's a LOT of big star power going to the G-League instead of college, and sports media will have to start paying some attention to it (can you imagine if SportsCenter had to remove one of its "talking heads giving their opinions" segments in order to show G-League highlights?? Oh, the humanity!)

Of course, depending how many they offer, at some point the damage to the college game in terms of quality would be noticeable. It will also be interesting to see what it does to the top recruiting schools; Calipari will have to adjust his style if all the guys he would have gone after are all going to the G-League. OR, offer more money than the G-League... in which case you are talking higher risks of getting caught.

And of course, the shoe contract trials are still ongoing (see the Wade thread here). Results of those could cause some changes.

It will be interesting to see how this shakes out.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 10:12 am 
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I don't see them offering 54. Maybe 10 per year tops.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:56 am 
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What could really influence this is if one and done is changed (as is likely) to something more baseball-ish, like if you go to college you have to stay two years. Then the equation changes to two years of the attention and plusher accommodations of college ball vs 1 year of Podunk cities and bus rides in the G league. Or is this plan just a bridge until one and done is changed?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:16 pm 
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ml wave wrote:
What could really influence this is if one and done is changed (as is likely) to something more baseball-ish, like if you go to college you have to stay two years. Then the equation changes to two years of the attention and plusher accommodations of college ball vs 1 year of Podunk cities and bus rides in the G league. Or is this plan just a bridge until one and done is changed?
Agree. The story I linked really is short on details... But that might be because they aren't decided yet.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:41 am 
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Update: New Balance is paying a kid $1MM guaranteed to sit out a year before entering the draft. I was thinking last week that the efforts Puma was making to sign top kids in the last draft might serve to increase the $ available in shoe deals but didn't factor in New Balance at all, and didn't think we'd see $1MM right out the gate. That's a lot of reasons not to go to college (or the G league, for that matter).


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:56 am 
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ml wave wrote:
Update: New Balance is paying a kid $1MM guaranteed to sit out a year before entering the draft. I was thinking last week that the efforts Puma was making to sign top kids in the last draft might serve to increase the $ available in shoe deals but didn't factor in New Balance at all, and didn't think we'd see $1MM right out the gate. That's a lot of reasons not to go to college (or the G league, for that matter).

Wow. The G-League offer just got bested. And by NEW BALANCE? I'm guessing they are making a play to get into the fray of top basketball shoe brands? If NB can do $1M, it won't be long before Nike and Adidas are doing $5M or $10M...

Side note: when Tulane brought hoops back in 1989, we had a New Balance contract. The one pair of running shoes we got for preseason conditioning on the track were fantastic; I wore the pair I got freshman year for all five years during preseason, and kept the pair each following year as "kicking around" shoes I'd wear to class. However, their basketball shoes were awful. The foam padding in the soles was not enclosed and was somewhat absorptive at the time, and we'd sweat so much during preseason conditioning (no AC in Fogelman then!) that there would literally be sweat squishing out of the soles every step we took. We virtually had to have managers following us with towels. It got so bad that, as we ran sprints, a few guys literally tore right out of the shoe while stopping to turn (leather upper came completely off the sole, tore the shoe in two). We moved to Nike in year three (good timing on their part, as we made the NCAA and won the conference) and I believe we've been Nike ever since.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:02 am 
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ml wave wrote:
Update: New Balance is paying a kid $1MM guaranteed to sit out a year before entering the draft. I was thinking last week that the efforts Puma was making to sign top kids in the last draft might serve to increase the $ available in shoe deals but didn't factor in New Balance at all, and didn't think we'd see $1MM right out the gate. That's a lot of reasons not to go to college (or the G league, for that matter).


This is a massive step forward and potentially eliminates the Adidas and related corruption. Let the high school player who doesn't want to go to college sign with an agent and shoe company when he is ready to turn pro not when the NBA/NCAA tells him too.

Also as with all anti-corruption tactics, transparency is cheaper. The shoe companies no longer have to pay off the college coaches. However it won't eliminate all middlemen/gatekeepers (like AAU coaches who the agents at least will still cultivate.)


In its own way this is just an update of Chamberlain taking a rest stop with the Trotters between KU and the Warriors.

Finally little did we know that LaVar Ball was just ahead of the curve (and presumably the FBI!)


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:12 pm 
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Baywave1 wrote:
ml wave wrote:
Update: New Balance is paying a kid $1MM guaranteed to sit out a year before entering the draft. I was thinking last week that the efforts Puma was making to sign top kids in the last draft might serve to increase the $ available in shoe deals but didn't factor in New Balance at all, and didn't think we'd see $1MM right out the gate. That's a lot of reasons not to go to college (or the G league, for that matter).


This is a massive step forward and potentially eliminates the Adidas and related corruption. Let the high school player who doesn't want to go to college sign with an agent and shoe company when he is ready to turn pro not when the NBA/NCAA tells him too.

Also as with all anti-corruption tactics, transparency is cheaper. The shoe companies no longer have to pay off the college coaches. However it won't eliminate all middlemen/gatekeepers (like AAU coaches who the agents at least will still cultivate.)


In its own way this is just an update of Chamberlain taking a rest stop with the Trotters between KU and the Warriors.

Finally little did we know that LaVar Ball was just ahead of the curve (and presumably the FBI!)

But is this a one-off attention getter or beginning of a trend? Does only NB do this bc Nike and Adidas are already in with all the colleges/coaches and they can run an end around? Would Nike/Adidas do this as well, or does that cannibalize their existing model?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:36 pm 
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Who knows? Generally startups who try to buy talent and market share only drive up costs for payers (and benefits to recipients) because established players refuse to give up on price only. In short Adidas and Nike will pay what they need to to keep NB down and out. 18 year olds and their parents and their agents will love it though.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:55 pm 
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Baywave1 wrote:
Who knows? Generally startups who try to buy talent and market share only drive up costs for payers (and benefits to recipients) because established players refuse to give up on price only. In short Adidas and Nike will pay what they need to to keep NB down and out. 18 year olds and their parents and their agents will love it though.

Oh, I agree who knows, wasn't thinking you had the answers (not trying to insult you there)...and, good for the 18 year olds and their parents.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:38 pm 
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Thanks for clarification. As I said, I'm most positive about this as an anti-corruption disinfectant and potentially eliminating the rent-a-college coach aspect of all this.

However thinking out of the box, this may perhaps truly help Tulane's MBB program. There is consensus here that absent an Ed Oliver like gift from heaven, Tulane is not going to be able to recruit 4 or 5 star one and doners here. The best MD will do is solid 3 stars who he can coach up. That's workable for a very successful program if in effect the one and doners disappear and most/all turn pro after high school. If your opponents no longer have these players and the corresponding massive edge in talent that can't be outcoached than perhaps Tulane can win seriously in MBB sooner rather than later.


As I said this is truly speculative. It depends upon basketball becoming like baseball where most great 18 year olds go pro then and don't wait until after some college. If they're not in college, we don't have to beat them. We'll see.


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