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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:28 pm 
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PeteRasche wrote:
Endymion canceled after yet another person killed. What is going on?!?

https://www.nola.com/news/crime_police/ ... 63ff8.html


my buddy is watching WWL and the city is going to ban tandem floats... like that's the problem... the problem is people walking up to the floats and doing stupid things... the entire parade route should be barricaded... but the city doesn't own enough barricades to do that for both st charles and mid city routes

Bacchus tomorrow night will be interesting if they have to separate each tandem float.. they would need double the tractors and would need to scramble to get generators to light all of the floats.

I wonder what float number gerryb is on in Endymion.. from what I understand, floats 15 through the end are being taken directly down Poydras and are not throwing anything, probably going to the convention center

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:46 pm 
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Johnny Mac wrote:
PeteRasche wrote:
Endymion canceled after yet another person killed. What is going on?!?

https://www.nola.com/news/crime_police/ ... 63ff8.html


my buddy is watching WWL and the city is going to ban tandem floats... like that's the problem... the problem is people walking up to the floats and doing stupid things... the entire parade route should be barricaded... but the city doesn't own enough barricades to do that for both st charles and mid city routes

Bacchus tomorrow night will be interesting if they have to separate each tandem float.. they would need double the tractors and would need to scramble to get generators to light all of the floats.

I wonder what float number gerryb is on in Endymion.. from what I understand, floats 15 through the end are being taken directly down Poydras and are not throwing anything, probably going to the convention center

Sounds like the ban might be starting next year. Apparently this was the same float that killed a rider getting off some years ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 9:49 pm 
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Nope, immediately. This is stupid.
The story I linked has already been updated, adding this :
Quote:
The accident at Wednesday night's Nyx parade also involved a tandem float, and Mayor LaToya Cantrell announced Saturday night that such floats will not be allowed during the remainder of the 2020 Carnival season.
...
For the remainder of the season, each float will require its own tractor, NOPD Superintendent Shaun Ferguson said Saturday night.


So many people are loathe to ever admit times and society have changed (glances sideways at Prof) but tell me why two people died this year and the last time it happened on a route was a three year old almost 40 years ago (the 2012 one was a rider getting off the float before it stopped moving at the end of the route)


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:02 pm 
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PeteRasche wrote:
Nope, immediately. This is stupid.
The story I linked has already been updated, adding this :
Quote:
The accident at Wednesday night's Nyx parade also involved a tandem float, and Mayor LaToya Cantrell announced Saturday night that such floats will not be allowed during the remainder of the 2020 Carnival season.
...
For the remainder of the season, each float will require its own tractor, NOPD Superintendent Shaun Ferguson said Saturday night.


So many people are loathe to ever admit times and society have changed (glances sideways at Prof) but tell me why two people died this year and the last time it happened on a route was a three year old almost 40 years ago (the 2012 one was a rider getting off the float before it stopped moving at the end of the route)

I misunderstood the initial report I read. There’s some folks scrambling tonight to make Bacchus work.


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:11 pm 
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Yeah, Bacchus and Orpheus are in full panic mode right now.

Next issue is someone pointing out the increase in air pollution from tripling the number of exhaust-spewing tractors.


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:13 pm 
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PeteRasche wrote:
Yeah, Bacchus and Orpheus are in full panic mode right now.

Next issue is someone pointing out the increase in air pollution from tripling the number of exhaust-spewing tractors.

Apparently Thoth has 15 of them. :shock:


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:41 pm 
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GretnaGrn wrote:
PeteRasche wrote:
Yeah, Bacchus and Orpheus are in full panic mode right now.

Next issue is someone pointing out the increase in air pollution from tripling the number of exhaust-spewing tractors.

Apparently Thoth has 15 of them. :shock:


It seemed like nearly every float in Iris was tandem too.


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:32 pm 
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on 10pm news, WWL had an eyewitness that said the dude was pushed from behind.. died right in front of his family... not confirmed, this was some random woman they interviewed

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:39 pm 
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Johnny Mac wrote:
on 10pm news, WWL had an eyewitness that said the dude was pushed from behind.. died right in front of his family... not confirmed, this was some random woman they interviewed

The Advocate is reporting that he jumped for a throw and landed on some ground debris and slid under the float FWIW


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:51 pm 
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Tandem floats are not the problem and our mayor is in over her head


Barricades are stupid too fwiw.


Reports say that both fatalities were linked to slipping on beads. Banning beads would make more sense than tandems (and no I’m not seriously suggesting that)

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:56 pm 
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WaveProf wrote:
Tandem floats are not the problem and our mayor is in over her head


Barricades are stupid too fwiw.


Reports say that both fatalities were linked to slipping on beads. Banning beads would make more sense than tandems (and no I’m not seriously suggesting that)


Or just staying the frick away from the floats

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 1:47 am 
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WaveProf wrote:
Tandem floats are not the problem and our mayor is in over her head


Barricades are stupid too fwiw.


Reports say that both fatalities were linked to slipping on beads. Banning beads would make more sense than tandems (and no I’m not seriously suggesting that)


Other reports say the first fatality was drunk as hell, provoked several complaints and was left out there to trip over a trailer hitch. As for this other unfortunate person I won't take any report at face value if it appears on standard media in this town.

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 7:29 am 
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This is all depressing. MG is not about needless deaths over trinkets or saving time on pedestrian detours.

None of us see less drinking in MG. Moreover massive weed use will turbocharge it in coming years. In short, I don't see improved judgment from thousands of impaired folks on the streets. So I get where a potential permanent ban on tandem trailers is coming from.

What says it all is main NOLA.com articles juxtaposed with NYX tragedy were about DUI enforcement.


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 8:27 am 
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WaveProf wrote:
Tandem floats are not the problem and our mayor is in over her head


Barricades are stupid too fwiw.


Reports say that both fatalities were linked to slipping on beads. Banning beads would make more sense than tandems (and no I’m not seriously suggesting that)


Yes to 1, and yes to 2. However, the mayor had to do something and the knee jerk reaction was to blame the float.
Barricades aren't actually stupid.. having ridden on a float with people walking up to the sides and banging on the float, girls on shoulders, I am amazed there aren't dozens of fatalities on Orleans and Carrollton alone for Endymion... every year! We can actually throw beads pretty far.. especially the guys upstairs... barricading the entire parade route is a better solution than banning tandem floats. It's just not economically feasible.

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:15 am 
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Barricades would cause more injuries not less. Wild post-k crowds pinning people against the rails.....

The only places where the cost benefit analysis really leans towards barricades is on curves/turns and on canal (where the sidewalks are wider)

That said, I’m not saying that people out in the street isn’t a problem. It is. There are police on the ground (write tickets). Have a huge social media campaign. Change the culture to one where you stay on the curb....

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 10:03 am 
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WaveProf wrote:
Barricades would cause more injuries not less. Wild post-k crowds pinning people against the rails.....

The only places where the cost benefit analysis really leans towards barricades is on curves/turns and on canal (where the sidewalks are wider)

That said, I’m not saying that people out in the street isn’t a problem. It is. There are police on the ground (write tickets). Have a huge social media campaign. Change the culture to one where you stay on the curb....


going along Canal near the Quarter the barricades don't seem to be injuring anyone.. but I see your point.. but again, it's not economically feasible, especially on Saturday with 2 parade routes to barricade.

I don't know if I mentioned it on this thread, but we used to have an NOPD officer that walked the entire route alongside our float for security purposes... but I don't remember them doing it after Katrina. I used to toss my empty bead bags to the officer to hand to kids along the route since they weren't very aerodynamic... having "security" marching along the gaps in tandem floats would work.. (not my idea, the Mardi Gras "expert" they had on WWL last night suggested this). I also had the idea they could string a flexible barrier, whether it's canvas or like a vinyl snow fence, across the gap. Kern could incorporate it into the decor of the float. It's going to cost Krewe's more money, regardless of what the final decision is.

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:29 am 
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One other point that does show the hand of the current admin in all this:

Parades now move at record speed apparently to reduce/eliminate police overtime. I watched Iris and some of Tucks which immediately followed it yesterday uptown. Heading to my car near Napoleon, I saw several riders from the beginning of Iris who had already walked some miles after defloating downtown returning uptown where they almost caught the end of Tucks which was just starting.

If the Mayor would have the parades move at mule speed like 120 years ago then they wouldn't be crushing spectators.


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:36 am 
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Johnny Mac wrote:
WaveProf wrote:
Tandem floats are not the problem and our mayor is in over her head


Barricades are stupid too fwiw.


Reports say that both fatalities were linked to slipping on beads. Banning beads would make more sense than tandems (and no I’m not seriously suggesting that)


Yes to 1, and yes to 2. However, the mayor had to do something and the knee jerk reaction was to blame the float.
Barricades aren't actually stupid.. having ridden on a float with people walking up to the sides and banging on the float, girls on shoulders, I am amazed there aren't dozens of fatalities on Orleans and Carrollton alone for Endymion... every year! We can actually throw beads pretty far.. especially the guys upstairs... barricading the entire parade route is a better solution than banning tandem floats. It's just not economically feasible.

Agree. I'm always on the bottom and even then, 8 to 10 feet away is easier to throw to than straight down. On the bottom I'm 8 feet up. And float 23 last night headed straight to the dome; had barely started rolling. I actually didn't ride this year, one of my dad's friends subbed in my spot.

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:41 am 
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It's not like closing off that gap between float sections is some difficult engineering task. I imagine that they will figure something out going forward, though that doesn't help for this year. I'm surprised that the folks insuring these parades didn't require something sooner.


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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:54 am 
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TU77CAL82 wrote:
It's not like closing off that gap between float sections is some difficult engineering task. I imagine that they will figure something out going forward, though that doesn't help for this year. I'm surprised that the folks insuring these parades didn't require something sooner.
Lessons learned, unfortunately, are often written in blood.

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 1:21 pm 
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Baywave1 wrote:
One other point that does show the hand of the current admin in all this:

Parades now move at record speed apparently to reduce/eliminate police overtime. I watched Iris and some of Tucks which immediately followed it yesterday uptown. Heading to my car near Napoleon, I saw several riders from the beginning of Iris who had already walked some miles after defloating downtown returning uptown where they almost caught the end of Tucks which was just starting.

If the Mayor would have the parades move at mule speed like 120 years ago then they wouldn't be crushing spectators.


Which dovetails with the fact that parades are much too long. In no other city are parades 5-6 miles long, albeit they are for pomp and circumstance more than anything. Heck, I can't remember which one it was - may have been Caeser in Metairie, but I remember marching in one that was 8 miles long!!

If you shorten the parade and go slower, the riders get the same time to party and safety is improved. For the highly popular Krewes like Endyminion, Bacchus, and MG day parades, I admit this may not work because it will bunch up the crowd more. But at least it can be used for the mid-week and lower attended Krewes.

But on the subject of OT - don't the Krewes pay in part for patrols? I thought that's what I recall.

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 2:26 pm 
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doncecco wrote:
Baywave1 wrote:
One other point that does show the hand of the current admin in all this:

Parades now move at record speed apparently to reduce/eliminate police overtime. I watched Iris and some of Tucks which immediately followed it yesterday uptown. Heading to my car near Napoleon, I saw several riders from the beginning of Iris who had already walked some miles after defloating downtown returning uptown where they almost caught the end of Tucks which was just starting.

If the Mayor would have the parades move at mule speed like 120 years ago then they wouldn't be crushing spectators.


Which dovetails with the fact that parades are much too long. In no other city are parades 5-6 miles long, albeit they are for pomp and circumstance more than anything. Heck, I can't remember which one it was - may have been Caeser in Metairie, but I remember marching in one that was 8 miles long!!

If you shorten the parade and go slower, the riders get the same time to party and safety is improved. For the highly popular Krewes like Endyminion, Bacchus, and MG day parades, I admit this may not work because it will bunch up the crowd more. But at least it can be used for the mid-week and lower attended Krewes.

But on the subject of OT - don't the Krewes pay in part for patrols? I thought that's what I recall.


WWL was saying last night Endymion paid for additional Jefferson Parish sheriff's office coverage for part of the route to help ease the burden on NOPD... but they were just doing their normal stuff and not making sure people weren't getting too close to floats.

In re insurance for the Krewes.. I'm not sure what Endymion paid out to the family of the guy crushed by the Captain Eddie's back in 2008, but if they have the same insurance company, another big check is going out, I'm sure.

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:01 pm 
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A rider fell off a float today in Thoth. Stable condition.

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 7:26 pm 
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WaveProf wrote:
A rider fell off a float today in Thoth. Stable condition.


yeah... happens all the time.. and with endymion an incident like that will once again make riders have to wear harnesses again... they suited us up with harnesses a few year ago and when we got on the float, the ropes we were supposed to attach ourselves to varied in length from "I can't move" to "if I fall, I'm still going to hit the ground and then get dragged along by the float"

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 Post subject: Re: Mardi Gras 2020
PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 8:59 pm 
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WaveProf wrote:
A rider fell off a float today in Thoth. Stable condition.

Two of them fell. Just a very unfortunate year.


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